The term “MMS” has taken on a life of its own, thanks to Jim Humble, a once itinerant contract gold prospector. On an expedition in the middle of nowhere he recognized that he had stumbled upon something of great importance when he helped two men, stricken with malaria, avert possible death after taking a hastily prepared concoction of “stabilized oxygen.”
Now, over 10 years later, after extensive solitary research, grass roots testing that started in Africa, three years after writing and self-publishing his book and countless private trials in the far flung corners of the world, the product that emerged from that fateful day has turned health prospects around for 100’s of thousands of people and animals.
However, instead of celebration or benign investigation, a spate of warnings were issued by the FDA. Public health agencies around the world were now on record that MMS had garnered their attention, and presently, it appears that they don’t want you to know any more about it.
I personally think that’s not going to happen. MMS use will grow, as more people learn how it works.
In the meantime, if you listen to the agencies’ warnings, you’d think that MMS and the chlorine dioxide that is generated from it (with the aid of an activator), was the most dangerous substance imaginable, that would cause your throat to melt as it went down or your hair to fall out. But wait, there is a long list of drugs that already make this happen, and they have earned – or shall I say that their companies have paid for — the FDA Seal of Approval!
The FDA doesn’t differentiate between natural which I refer to as “public domain” chemicals, and synthetic, or patented pharmaceuticals. They get a good penny for granting approvals that allow these companies — the most profitable on the planet — to issue poisons to the public. They hold purveyors of unpatentable products up to the same economic barrier, and standard of proof. But why does “proof” have to be demonstrated for something we can understand in a high school chemistry class?
Perhaps they can’t fathom the idea of the public knowing that the “bugs” we spend billions of dollars for, and lose lives over, each year could be controlled with the help of a few drops of water disinfectant that carries oxygen?
On the other hand, why does paying a fee that can be millions of dollars justify approving drugs that clearly are dangerous, but the agency and the medical industry embrace as staple tools? The anticoagulant Coumadin (also marketed as Warfarin) is one example. According to Wikipedia, the product was originally marketed as a pesticide for rats and mice, and is still popular for that use. I’ve made these observations before, and will likely make them again. How can introducing a chemical designed to kill life help life get healthier?
Now I realize that there is a logic associated with Coumadin use (as well as chemotherapy, etc.) that existed before the product became a popular medicine, but shouldn’t an “efficacy check” be ongoing? If you look at the effects that coumadin has on overall chemical and microbial balance in the body, I’m willing to bet that it is not improved. All that synthetic, unmetabolized stuff has to be stored somewhere, and the body attempts to maintain functionality as long as possible, and then existence as long as possible. That is life’s purpose.
I find it ironic that researchers often test products on mice and rats, determining their safety by how quickly they kill. Here’s a product (Coumadin, etc.) that was designed to kill rats and mice, and yet it is approved for “therapeutic” use in humans! Do they really believe that this is the best our “research” can come up with?
I have speculated, and continue to, that the problem may not be in the microbial population, but in the deluge of inorganic material we expose ourselves to — voluntarily and involuntarily — each day. I believe that microbial forces of certain types (i.e., aerobic and anaerobic) proliferate under certain environmental conditions; conditions that change according to the presence of (1) adequate hydration, (2) a full-spectrum mineral presence, and (3) proper movement and elimination of waste matter. Predominant methods of water and food processing severely compromises the first two factors, which by combined effect, then compromises the third.
The various agencies are too busy protecting and defending the system to actually assess what effects it is having on the public, and more importantly, whether better approaches are available. MMS is showing results that the agencies want their expensive, limited access, approved chemicals to demonstrate, but aren’t. So instead of taking a genuine look at it, they use the last bit of confidence that the public might have had in them, and tell them straight up, “This stuff is bad, don’t go near it!”
So the public grapples with conflicting information. Who are they to believe? Since this is easily verifiable science, don’t you think the FDA would have checked their data before making their claims? I would certainly think so, at least, that is what I would expect of any science-based organization. But science is only as effective as the scope of its study and inquiry, and its commitment to truth. Schooled at the University of Pharmacology (with campuses all over the world), FDA scientists and other researchers see nature as an alien landscape with which they are unfamiliar and have little interest, except if they can patent a trait that they have observed, thereby limiting benefits that were intended for all to an elite few. Unable to do that with MMS, their information is therefore misleading; a blend of truth, half-truth, and outright falsehood.
Who, on the other hand, would listen to a geezer named Humble? Detractors criticize his writing style, others criticize his grasp of chemistry. They call him a charlatan and ridicule his efforts to build an aura of protection around himself through a church.
Yet, his information about chlorine dioxide has been confirmed time and time again by the effects. Even if clinical trials have not been done in a manner that would satisfy “critics”… (a “satisfied critic” is an oxymoron if I ever heard one), there is enough information available on the nature of the chlorine dioxide molecule to postulate its potential as a superior substitute for a myriad of currently used pharmaceuticals.
In spite of the much higher price that could have been charged for a product that actually works and reduces one’s toxic, fungal, and microbial load, as a condition of sharing his information with sellers, Humble made them promise to keep the retail price low, so as to make it available to anyone who needed it. He even gave instructions on how to make it on one’s own.
An evolution ensued, and new people are now questioning and denouncing the use of this “industrial bleach” only to eventually see it for what it is, and can become.
More Scientific Support For Chlorine Dioxide Use
Today someone sent me yet another piece of scientific evidence of the efficacy of chlorine dioxide. This one, created in 2001 is titled, “Sodium Chlorate, A Potential Treatment of Salmonella in Pigs,” was produced by the Canadian Ministry of Agriculture Food & Rural Affairs.
It points out that there are 1.4 million cases of human Salmonellosis and 600 deaths annually in the United States. Bacteria can be passed during meat processing due to fecal spillage from evisceration. Therefore, reducing the amount of Salmonella in the gut and feces is considered a good thing.
They elected to follow a strategy set forth in a laboratory study conducted by USDA scientists in 2001 and outlined, according to the abstract, in the Journal of Food Protection.
It turns out that E. coli and Salmonella contain an enzyme, known as respiratory nitrate reductase, which converts the chlorate into chlorite (ClO2), which, in turn, kills both pathogens. In other words, the pathogens have enzymes within them that, upon contact with the chlorine dioxide molecule, initiates the oxidative event that eliminates the pathogen.
Aerobic bacteria, on the other hand, do not have the respiratory nitrate reductase enzyme, and are not affected by chlorine dioxide. (Sounds pretty much like what Jim Humble has said all along.)
The researchers observed a 150-fold reduction in intestinal Salmonella after administering the chlorate tablets.
They conclude:
The research is still in the early stage and this new approach needs to be approved by the FDA before it can be widely used by the U.S. livestock industry. Possible applications include feeding chlorate to animals before they are transported to slaughter or adding it to drinking water before loading or at lairage.
It’s likely that said approval has not been granted, even though it is for pigs. I’m happy to be wrong, and issue an apology. But if these scientists observed such profoundly beneficial changes, and pig physiology works very much like humans, then this is more third-party evidence that the FDA, all its cronies, and the new-found legion of critics, are wrong about chlorine dioxide.
It’s now almost 10 years since this research was done, before Jim Humble was a gleam in the FDA’s eye, or committed the “sin” of informing the public that chlorine dioxide might be helpful. Once we hit a critical mass of irrefutable evidence, they’ll act as though they knew it was a good thing all along.
—————–
MMS Workshop Video Update
After a first production run that produced more errors than base hits (a little World Series humor), Jim Humble’s 5-day MMS Workshop presentation re-emerges as an 8-disc set.
New shipments will start the week of November 8. Orders are being accepted.
Listen
You can listen to Jim Humble explaining the two fundamental Protocol strategies by following the link below:
Simunye.
Or, maybe Eve figured out that mmsfraud is Adam2 . LOL.
But maybe mmsfraud is a sad situation,, he could have some very serious problems, or medical condition, that nothing could help, and he knows that MMS would not help him either, and maybe that is his problem. We dont know, maybe he is just a bad, incompetent doctor.
But I think trax was right, he could be just a brainless bot.
Lol, doing what you do best, making excuses.. Absolutely NONE of your guesses are even remotely true, but it would make you feel better if they were right? I’m not Adam2, I’m just a regular person, i have a regular office day job, i have no health problems and I’m not a doctor or have anything to do with the health profession. But accusing me of being a bot, that’s the funniest one, lol, if you really think that, you are deluded, pity MMS doesn’t cure “gullible”. lol. You think I’m a bot and Simunye thinks I’m a bully just because I would like to see some of the tests that even she agrees SHOULD exist.. Hopeless cause both of you.
COPY, of what I wrote
“Others only share it with selected people because of bullies and people LIKE YOU.”
WOW, I know my English is not perfect, but either yours is worse, you don’t read properly, you read what you want to hear, or the shoe fits and hence you put it on. Take your pick! 😉
Hey Adam,
Why don’t you take a short ride to where J Humble is in Mexico and see first hand. That should clear things up for you one way or the other.
Then you can actually speak from a position of knowledge.
And not the position of ignorant fool pretending to seek truth through peer acceptance.
Are you sure you are talking to Adam?
He needs no peer-acceptance as far as I can see.
He is well ahead of many of us here on this blog.
Thanks Adam, keep up the good work! 🙂
Simunye
I think Eve posted that for mmsfraud.
Gilgamesh, I also thought so…but never mind. Her description fits MMSfraud better than Adam.
As far as I know has Adam been doing already what she suggested anywhere. Therefore he knows what he is talking about.
Which goes to prove that Ewe also does not know what she is talking about, because she did not read what was written before on this blog. But lets face it, there is a lot to read for somebody new, so it is understandable to draw the wrong conclusions. Never mind, she is not the only one. 😉
I am really happy to find this post. please post more for us to read… Jim Thanks
Jim Humble went to Africa, and he cured malaria,and AIDs patients, With MMS, and he saved thousands of lives.
Says Jim Humble. We have only his word for those rather extraordinary claims. There is zero independent evidence that any of those things happened.
Humble is a con-man, pure and simple.
Adam, Jim Humble is innocent until proven guilty.
THATS THE LAW! So stop playing the proccecuter, judge, jury and if we let you, the ‘hangman’!
🙂
That’s OK, Monika, Humble has been proven guilty in a court of law.
http://www.bnltimes.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=2399&Itemid=29
But my main point was not whether or not Humble is a criminal (although clearly he is). My main point is that he has no evidence for his claims that MMS cures malaria or AIDS.
He is only guilty of ‘practicing without license’.
But you need a license for your ‘dangerous mouth’ to kill peoples reputation WITHOUT proof!
Copy & paste is NO proof!
🙂
Well, clearly the court that convicted Jim Humble thought there was proof.
http://www.bnltimes.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=2399&Itemid=29
“Bishop” Humble rumbled!
We all knew that was going to happen, did we? So what is new!
At least they refrained from killing him till now…
🙂
I really don’t have a clue what you’re saying here. Humble and his crony were convicted of criminal offences. Thus, even if he was conducting a “clinical trial”, it would seem that he was conducting such “trials” without ethical approval, informed consent, safety monitoring. That would place him on a par with the Nazi regimes from WW2 concentration camps where Mengele and others abused and tortured their victims – victims who were treated as vermin, not humans.
Hey, Little “d” —
You ARE a “bot!” You’re repeating yourself (again). You’re not doing that good of a job representing the “learned” point-of-view.
You’ve used those same phrases several times now, while supporting a system that TODAY treats people in a similar, inhumane way. Jim Humble did no one any harm. While YOU didn’t notice, there was no mention of ANYONE being harmed by what he did. He paid his fine (it’s all about money), and left the country.
What has the 2nd world war with the prices of eggs today to do? You are jumping to conclusion… 🙂
Jim Humble is neither German, no Jew, but he is expecting to killed one day and not by Germans, I assure you.
Being arrested was the least of his worry…
http://www.vaccinationcouncil.org/2010/07/06/quack/
Wriiten by an MD…
Copy and paste, if you dare too…hi…hi…
🙂
Correction: Not I’m in the dog-box, but Dr. Zuzanne Humphries is! After I posted her link ADAM had the cheek to post the following INSULTING question to her:
Suzanne, I have two questions for you.
1. Are you really a proper doctor? You know, with a license to practice and all that?
2. Do you know what a “clinical trial” or a “systematic review” is? I ask because most people who understand those concepts would not talk of homoeopathy as being a serious form of treatment.
How dare you Adam? You are disgusting! Asking for proof and than suggesting to a MP that she is NOT an MP! I will write an letter of apology to her on your be halve because your attitude sucks!
If terrorizing any and everybody who does not agree with your anti-alternative-attitude is all you can do, I feel sorry for you.
What proof do WE have that for example Paul Morgan is a real doctor?
Kindergarden is closed now … :@
Well, you may just believe everything anyone tells you without question, but some of us think that things like proof and evidence are important.
Sorry if that’s such an alien concept to you.
Oh, and now it seems that “Dr” Humphries has deleted my comment from her blog. The old “la la la I’m not listening” school of argument.
Now I disagree with most of what Phaelosopher says, but despite that, I absolutely respect the fact that he is man enough to come and argue in a meaningful way with me and the others who come to this blog to warn about the dangers of MMS. That seems a much more grown-up way of carrying on.
What has this got to do with MMS? Another feeble attempt at distracting from the MMS safety and efficacy debate.
Hi Richard
Good point ask, but why do those anti-alternative-medicine-fanatics want US to suffer AGAIN, who MMS who are using it already for a long time and who KNOW it works. Why ask for proof, if you don’t take it from the horses mouth, yet they willing to copy and paste any AAM-article they can possible find.
Research means finding the proof, which again means finding the pro’s AND con’s, not just one site.
I lived with the con’s for over 55 years and now I know there is something different that helps me, so WHO ARE THEY to dictate to me to stop using it?
WHO are THEY to call people idiots, quacks, charlatans ect?
Last time I looked the law said:
INNOCENT UNTIL PROVEN GUILTY
not
GUILTY UNTIL PROVEN INNOCENT
🙂
Anecdotes are not evidence. Please post real, credible, verifiable evidence regarding MMS safety and efficacy.
Given the current state of the evidence, MMS and its advocates are guilty.
What if Jim Humble’s MMS will erupt into the World, like a fiery volcano, and become more famous than Elvis Presley , and all the doctors, clinics, and hospitals around the World will start using MMS. And it is more likely, than not, this could happen, almost overnight. Would you be still demanding evidence, and spread misinformation?
If I accused you of murder and wanted that crime punishable by death and if I could rustle up a few people that agreed with me would you gladly go to the gallows because of the anecdotal stories or might you demand some evidence that could be challenged openly? I would. Why then should anyone just accept anecdotal evidence for MMS? Why not produce evidence that can be challenged and if found to be correct everybody wins, MMS evangelists can be justifiably smug and patients get better. Everybody who is a skeptic would love MMS claims to be true because (and this is guess I admit) they are all caring individuals who have no desire to see people suffer. People may want the sun to rise in the west but what people want to true and what is aren’t always the same thing
EVIDENCE would support your accusation, if it were TRUE. All stories are anecdotal, even the ones that the peer reviewers come up with. The only thing that convinces you of their finding’s “truth” is the appearance of unanimity. Yet, the actual EVIDENCE may not support even them. When it does not, we then tell ourselves that there’s something else we need to learn.
Evidence comes in many forms. Truth comes in one form, a feeling within the individual that embraces it. Truth does not exist outside of the people who embrace it as so. When you embrace the idea that a cancer cure does not yet exist as truth, then it becomes “true” for YOU. People have cured themselves of cancer and every other disease under the sun. Only in our generation has the idea of “incurability” been taken as gospel. Even during the plagues, there were those who were unaffected (people who used silver spoons, “blue bloods”). Even during pandemics (1918 flu), certain methods proved 80% effective).
What is your point in “challenging” evidence when you’re already convinced of its untruth? If you are willing to examine the available science on chlorine dioxide, you could answer whether it works for yourself.
The individuals that have camped on this site to voice opposition to MMS have been blind and silent, or dismissive to the EXISTING factors that are contribute disease, their attention so focused on dissuading anyone from using MMS. This is totally irrational, if they were honestly concerned about human health. Their concern is protecting the current way things are done. I don’t want to see people suffer either. And MILLIONS are suffering as a result of how things have been done, and are being done NOW.
At the very least, we’d be in agreement with that. Don’t you agree?
Amateurs built the ark, Professionals built the Titanic!
That might be true, but wasn’t it the Ark that survived the storm?
Hmmmm……..I think I’ll stick with the Amateurs …………
If we can’t all agree to disagree, then maybe we can laugh together?
The irony of your talking about “evidence” really is lost on you, isn’t it?
Not really. You’re the one that appears “lost” in this exchange.
Adam (2) sure Adam(1) can argue better with you. he knows MMS longer, better and he knows the in and outs.
I can only speak from experience, and since you don’t believe that,I don’t see why I must waste my time repeating myself here.
If you behave like a child, you must not be surprised if you are treated like one. Good for DR. Humphries to delete you, because your comment was disrespectful to say the least, since it was standing above that she is MD.
I delete or ban anyone who has no manners and is abusive, including doctors, if they think their title means they allowed to misbehave!
But then, what’s new?
🙂
Gosh, Monika, you really are sending my irony meter into overdrive. Your friend “Dr” Humphries simply deletes comments from someone who disagrees with her, and you say I’m the one behaving childishly?
Paul,
The people who support MMS do so because they too have studied the available evidence.
You can say what you want about chlorine dioxide, that same “nasty, dangerous stuff” that you refer to has been a healing agent for many people. If you were truly open minded, you’d want to know why and how, and you’d cooperatively interact with people here and elsewhere, instead of acting like the troll that you’ve become here.
I don’t plant myself on other peoples’ sites or blogs to evangelize MMS, or tell people who stupid or wrong they are for having an opinion that differs from mine. I even tolerate your doing that here. No one is that closed minded without having made the choice to be that way.
Even WordPress has flagged some of your posts as spam, which I then chose to approve.
I’m not really interested in “debating” with you or anyone about this. But if I’m going to allow you to be here, then I’m going to respond to your biased posts. I’m not trying to change your mind, since it’s not yet yours to change. You’ll have to take it back before you can do that yourself.
Until you demonstrate that you YOURSELF are open minded enough to respect opinions that differ from your own (this doesn’t even require your agreement on MMS), I’ll simply think of you “dR Morgan,” with a little “d”. Even if you arent’ a real doctor, your attitude sounds like how many (but not all) doctors have addressed MMS users.
You could really benefit by demonstrating the tolerance and respect that has been shown you.
news-flash Adam (2)
Dr Humphries does not know me, neither do I know her!
Besides, you did not disagree with her, you ask her a disrespectful question, insinuating, she is a liar! That is abusive… not ironic! 🙂
So, we now have a small band of people who share a common false belief that MMS is some sort of wonder-drug, a “miracle” cure. Awww, bless (so to speak). There is a saying that a problem shared is a problem halved – is it now that the case that a delusion shared is a delusion doubled?
Some – to be fair – try to be rational, but the problem is the starting point for them is one of total irrationality making it almost impossible for them to get anywhere. Most, however, are completely incapable of rationality as they are totally closed to any viewpoint that challenges them with evidence. The MMS advocates have been asked multiple times to provide real, credible, verifiable evidence to support their viewpoint – I’m yet to see a response that actually provides any such evidence.
My advice is to Google the phrases “cognitive dissonance” and “crank magnetism”. Explains so much about the ongoing irrationality.
Sorry, I don’t normally comment but I find this post really quite frightening, in that people who may trust and believe the author or supporters could end up using this.
I personally use a lot of herbs rather than reach for tablets where possible. If I suddenly discovered a remedy that soothed and calmed and reduced many symptoms containing mandrake and started urging people to take it as a cure-all, I would expect to be shouted down and have legal action taken against me.
Why? Because mandrake is a toxin, can cause miscarriage and death. But it can be a great healer in the right dose and to the right person….
So this is why clinical trials exist. To knock out the ‘it works for me’ school of treatment and to ensure ‘it’s safe for everyone if you follow doctors advice’ school of medicine.
And several people have mentioned Warfarin. Arrow said “People who take coumadin never get better”. This is patently untrue. An anecdocte from me, as evidence doesn’t seem to hold sway: my mum had it on a regular basis for several weeks after my birth as she was at high risk of thrombosis. She came off it, never been on it again, she’s now nearly 80. Hurrah for warfarin I say!
I would love it if MMS was proved to be effective in curing as described. I’ve had Crohns disease for over 15 years and I have suffered considerably over those years. However, until I can see proof that this will cure me I will not even think about taking it. Adam is right, anecdotes are not proof. If they were then if I said that MMS killed my entire family that should be enough to make everyone taking it stop?
Adam.
I did not say that, MMS was intended as a religious ritual.
I was thinking closer to what Albert Einstein Said;
“The most beautiful thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the source of all true art and science. He to whom this emotion is a stranger is as good as dead; his eyes closed…. To know what is impenetrable to us really exist, manifesting itself as the highest wisdom and the most radiant beauty which our dull faculties can comprehend only in their most primitive forms, this knowledge, this feeling, is at the center of true religiousness”
The problem here is that people who advocate MMS usually do so with religious zeal, characterised by blind faith, fairytale-like stories, zero evidence and a complete refusal to even consider that there is evidence to the contrary. Blind faith is bunkum – I demand evidence.
If anyone demand evidence, and proof that MMS works. the truth is already out there, for anyone who is really interested.
But, what I see here, is that some people get very upset about the truth, and in my opinion they should go, and see Professional Aroma Therapist.
I am really interested. I would love to see the truth. Why don’t you publish it so that I can?
Oh dear. I don’t understand why people who love mms and take it on anecdotal evidence are so sure that scientist and doctors and nurses and pharmacists etc are so anti anything that really would cure sickness. The organisation and covering up needed to keep them all quiet would be huge. Every medical person I have come across during treatment for a condition I have suffered from for years would happily use anything prooved to work. They wanted me to get better. They succeeded. Yes the medicines had side effects, but because they have been properly tested those effects ( and my likelyhood of getting them) were known. All science (& the skeptical community) asks is that mms is proved to be effective. So far the only scientific testing done has shown mms to be dangerous hence the FDA warning. And the equivalent in the uk. Incidentaly , in the uk we have the nhs. The nhs is poor. It would grab a cheap effective cure-all with both hands. But the cure would have to be proved. Proved.
I don’t think that all doctors are anti MMS because some are using it and there is plenty proof for that. But even when doctors approve of MMS the AAMF will not accept this.
We are running here in circles, and both sides have made their point. We agreed to disagree, because we are getting tired to repeating our self, as you can surely appreciate.
I have my own prove, my health after one year of MMS and if that is just anecdotes for you, than so be it. I do not NEED to prove anything to ANYBODY but myself.
God bless…
🙂
simunye1- or should I say Monika Scholze (HELLO!!!!) – please supply the names of real medical doctors who are pro-MMS. Phaelosopher himself refused previously when challenged – could this be because there aren’t any? If you mean Hesselink and Humiston, both of these have been debunked multiple times. for example, why is Humiston practicing in an “alt med” clinic in Tijuana when he is a “family doctor” from the USA? No publications or recognisable relevant experience in the areas he claims to be a “consultant” in (candida, chronic fatigue).
Monika – your claims are nothing but unverifiable anecdotes. When I think of you, the term “crank magnetism” comes to mind as an explanation for your multiple delusions.
simunye1 (or is that you, Monika?), it’s not clear to me whether you are one of the people selling MMS and therefore just making stuff up about it or whether you genuinely believe it has helped you.
If the latter, I am not going to tell you what to think, because as we’ve agreed earlier, it’s much better if you think for yourself.
I will, however, give you some tools that will help you to think for yourself. There are 3 phrases you should look up. Consider them all carefully in the light of your experiences with MMS, and then I’ll leave you to draw your own conclusions.
1. Placebo effect
2. Illusory correlation
3. Confirmation bias
Hi Sir Doctor Morgan
You may call me whatever you want, as long as you don’t call me an IDIOT again. smile…
SIMUNYE means WE ARE ONE, and what we do onto others, we do onto our-self. It is off course a spiritual meaning, but one that I take serious!
You have a problem with that too?
Links to what real doctors have to say have been posted for you and you clan over and over again on all websides, so why don’t you keep a copy of those links instead of asking over and over again.
Sorry, I forgot, all other doctors BUT YOU are ‘insignificant’ according to your statement made when one doctors link was posted. But in the meantime their are more and more doctors who will not be intimidated by the likes of you into silence! But don’t ask for further links, because I know you can find them your self; provided you look for PRO-MMS-PROOF, and not for ANTI-MMS-PROOF. Have fun…
By the way: where is YOUR proof for people who were killed by MMS? Silvia? We still wait for the coroners report…waiting, waiting, waiting…
“Links to what real doctors have to say have been posted for you”
I must have missed those. There are. to the best of my knowledge, no real doctors who recommend MMS. If you think I’m wrong, please say who those doctors are and what they have said.
I just started a post on my profile about;:
My experience with MMS
EVERYBODY is welcome to add ‘their experience’ to mine!
I said EXPERIENCE guys, not OPNIONS, right!
http://simunye1.wordpress.com/category/mms-jim-humble/
Lets see how many ‘experiences’ we can get under one roof! 🙂
Please send link to other users!
be sure, I will not allow abuse on my site. 🙂
Experience and opinions are about as worthless as each other in science. What is important is properly conducted clinical trials, with real data.
Until any of the MMS apologists produce anything like that, the scientific community will not take you seriously.
If you genuinely believe MMS has benefits, do the trials, publish them, and then I and others will believe you.
But of course we all know that you have no intention of doing any proper clinical trials, because you know perfectly well it would show that MMS has no benefits and only does harm.
Says WHO? Oh of course: says VIP-YOU. 🙂
Nobody forces you you take MMS or believe it, so what is your problem!
“Those who have no problem, make them,” my mother always use to say!
I see her point…-)
Says me and pretty much anyone else with any qualifications as a scientist, since you ask.
If you think MMS works, show us the data. If it looks good, we’ll believe you. Why is that so much to ask?
Adam’s purpose is to inhibit logical thinking, deductive reasoning, personal discovery and knowing. Actually, perhaps it’s not his purpose. However, it is the EFFECT of the method that he repeats with such conviction. The “data” is all around you and available. The understanding of it only comes from your willingness to know for yourself, irrespective of anyone else’s opinion.
You set yourself up as “the authority” and “judge,” demanding the “subjects” to deliver morsels of information for you, as some sort of ruling class, to validate. Such a fairy tale.
It could be a latent resentment at his own status as a “subject” of, or to British royalty and its ruling class. Deep down inside, perhaps he wants to be the ruler of something. Then, here comes Jim Humble with MMS saying to orthodox medical science that “the King has no clothes.”
Don’t bet your fee on all scientists waiting until “the data” is released before validating MMS. While you may label them unqualified, the truth is that not all are so bound to the “program of obedience” as you. A growing number are permitting themselves to think on their own, and KNOW for themselves.
boring same old story! I’m not a gramphone and your LP is stucktucktucktuck…
Go and read the M&S Bible and paly with your friends. I’m past kindergarden, and your OPINION means nothing to me and plenty others who KNOW better… 🙂
I’m not sure whether you are being deliberately obtuse or whether you really haven’t understood. I’ll try one more time.
Nobody except the terminally gullible are going to believe a few random people on websites saying “I reckon that…”. “Logical thinking” is never going to take such rubbish as a reasonable standard of evidence.
Yes, I know there are people on websites who say that MMS has helped them. There are also people on websites who say that they have been abducted by aliens. Would you also accuse me of “inhibiting logical thinking” if I said I don’t believe that people have been abducted by aliens?
If you want people to believe you, you have to produce verifiable evidence.
Of course, I don’t demand that you produce evidence that MMS works. You are quite free not to if you wish.
All I am saying is that no-one other than those who are predisposed to believe in fairy tales will believe you if you continue to rely on unverifiable hearsay.
If you don’t care about that, then by all means carry on as you are.
Thank you Adam for your permission to being allowed to think for our-self. 🙂
You have not only my permission to think for yourself, but also my encouragement.
Look at the evidence. Don’t believe what those who make money from selling MMS tell you as automatically being the gospel truth.
And when looking at the evidence, consider how reliable it is. Learn to distinguish verifiable evidence from anecdote.
Translated copy of the ‘abusive reply’ to Marc’s REVIEW under Jims book:
Well, have you been paid r by the pharmaceutical industry for this review? Why can such miracle cure not be? ‘Can’t be’, would be referred to by the pharmaceutical industry, accurate, or? I use it myself for over a year and it has a lot of my health changed for the better . In contrast to the sometimes fatal side effects of drugs of conventional medicine I praise “my” MMS! Such reviews can only put a smile on my face. Each user who tried MMS , knows exactly how it works 🙂
Now where is the abuse shiroboshi/Marc from Manchester?
Simunye1
In my opinion pharmaceutical drugs have very low, or no spiritual component in them,and this could make them very dangerous, or not very effective, and hardly ever cure anything, maybe just treat the symptoms,and cause more side effects. And everybody, even the experts know this.
Maybe MMS have a higher spiritual component,and it really cures diseases
without any bad side effects,and makes people even healthier.
And I think that is why people call it a miracle product.
Spiritual component? How exactly does bleach have a spiritual component? Do you mean that MMS is not intended to be a pharmaceutical product, but part of some kind of religious ritual?
It takes Wisdom to understand the above, not knowledge dear…
🙂
You see, capitalism and spirituality are 2 different shoes. That is why the cheaper MMS is sold by more spiritual inclined people who want to help people at a low cost involved or even for free, whilst the capitalist want only their best: their/our money!
🙂
Even if it were true that MMS was being sold for altruistic purposes rather than to make a quick buck, how on earth would that make any difference to whether it works?
But anyway, it isn’t true. MMS is all about making money from people who are gullible enough to fall for it.
http://sites.google.com/site/mmsdebunked/home/jim-humble-claims/altruism
If the people who have used MMS — something that is helping people heal — are gullible, then how gullible are YOU for using your educational credentials to “validate” a system that makes hundreds of billions are made EACH YEAR, while people get sicker?
I guess it’s just job security, eh?
All that education didn’t give you the ability, courage, or ethical responsibility to figure out, and know truth for yourself.
M&S Bible
1st commandment: M&S&Co are always right
2nd commandment: if M&S&Co are wrong, commandment no1 applies…
3rd commandment: thou shall not read another Bible than the M&S Bible …noncompliance will be tracked down and punished by AAMF’s
bla, bla, bla… 🙂
Answer to you question @8:05am:
It makes no differance, IT SIMPLY WORKS!
“I guess it’s just job security, eh?”
Just remind us all what you do for a living, Phaelosopher?
I was looking a bit around and saw on twitter the following remark:
Woo! Got my first abusive comment and big pharma allegations for my review of Humble’s book on Amzon.de http://amzn.to/ahIKg1 #bleachgate
Hmmm, correct me if I’m wrong, but is writing a review under a book which you did not buy or read not plain bull? How can you review some book without reading it. I fully agree with the comment of Dana, which by the way is not abusive at all, but just something that WE are telling you all along.
So if somebody claims something which is not truh, what do we call that?
Dishonest, lie, bull…ect…
Go and read you M&SBible instead of writing fake-reviews dear!
Amazon is no kindergarden…
Gosh, you really have very little idea what you are talking about, don’t you? I have better things to do with my time than pull to pieces every ridiculous statement you make (and Paul has done a good job with some of them anyway), but let’s just focus on one, namely warfarin.
You say it has no effect on microbial balance. Well, duh. It isn’t intended to. It is intended as an anticoagulant. If you want to affect microbial balance, then we have antibiotics. You might as well say that paracetamol is useless because it doesn’t cure cancer. In the real world, different drugs treat different conditions. It is only in the fantasy world which you seem to inhabit that a single drug is believed to cure all known diseases at the same time.
“How can introducing a chemical designed to kill life help life get healthier?”, you ask. Well, because for some patients, the anticoagulant effects that are so dangerous in rodents are actually very useful.
But here’s the thing, and this is an important point which I don’t think you’ve grasped. Nobody just assumed that warfarin would be a useful drug: it has been tested in clinical trials. That’s how we know it is a useful drug, and also how we know in which patients it is useful and in which patients it shouldn’t be taken. Here is a systematic review of clinical trials that shows that in one particular group of patients, warfarin saves lives.
http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/o/cochrane/clsysrev/articles/CD001927/frame.html
That’s how proper science is done. People do clinical trials, and publish them in scientific journals. They don’t just make a whole load of stuff up and hope that if they put in a few scientific sounding words, someone will believe them.
I tried to figure out where you got the idea that I said that warfarin has no effect on balance, since I know better. So this is what I said:
The operative word there is not, as in balance is not improved. There’s a big difference between that and saying that it has no effect on balance. Warfarin certainly has an effect… a negative effect on microbial balance.
Warfarin has a negative effect, as does the antibiotics.
You can spare me the sanctimony and the lecture on how “proper” science is done, when you can’t (actually won’t, since I know that you can) even read proper meaning in a sentence.
OK, I misunderstood: clearly you are being even more ridiculous than I thought. I thought you were expressing disappointment that warfarin has no effect on microbial balance.
But no, you were actually claiming it has a negative effect on it.
Fascinating. Got any evidence?
Although I have no insight to any effects that warfarin has on microbes I have seen the death that it causes first hand in hospital and hospice from its bleeding effects.
Not only that, warfarin causes calcification of the arteries which will lead the patient to further vascular and cardiac disease.
Aside from warfarin being a very dangerous drug there are a number of natural products that can do the same work without any side effects, including nattokinase which should be administered when blood fibrogen levels start to rise as they tend to do in many people over 50 years old. Another natural supplement that can do the job is fish oil. That with the elimination of the death diet of white flour and sugar the clotting factors generally return to normal in a relatively short period of time.
Of course warfarin has helped prevent stroke in many people but its potenial for danger is significant and it does have an black box warning for causing “fatal bleeding”. Every year thousands die from the use of warfarin causing excessive bleeding, often associated with internatl bleeding from a fall.
Not only is warfarin dangerous to take and requries repeated monitoring to maintain safe levels it does absolutey nothing to heal the patient. People who take coumadin never get better. They are generally chained to the drug for the rest of their lives or until the risk factor for bleeding from warfarin exceeds the danger from having a blood clot.
The greatest failure of the medical profession is to use these drugs without educationg their patients and society in general
to right diet and those natural substances that promote health, not repress it as warfarin does. Warfarin blocks a number of chemical pathways that are essential for health and this is part of the reason it is known to cause calcium build up in the vessels.
But I cannot blame individual doctors too much. They have not been educated into the truth. They have been programed by medical schools that are by and large funded by pharmaceutical companies. They have been signficiantly brain washed and they have been fortified in their ego to believe that only they can be right.
Though the efforts to the pharmaceutical industtry, the AMA and the FDA the truth has been withheld from the public in favor of promoitn drugs with soaring profits. The deaths assocaited with these drugs are FDA SANCTIONED DEATHS.. this does not make these deaths anymore tolerable than any death that may come from a natural substance. So far no deaths have been documentented from MMS. I have only seen true restoration of health where the person becomes well and can then leaving the treatment behind. Spme people have been restored from some very serious and documented diseases.
And out come the deluded! No big surprise there. Phaelosopher regurgitates and rehashes the same nonsense about “Bishop” Humble and attempts to portray him as some sort of saint or martyr. The truth is, of course, so far removed from this as to make Phaelospher’s words the complete nonsense that they are.
He comments about Humble’s “years of solitary research” – the only place we ever have read anything on Humble’s “research” is in his own writings. Not one solitary scrap of his “findings” has ever been published anywhere of note. Zero. No publications in any scientific or medical journals to enable a proper critique of his “research” methodology. No published data. No publication as to how he had his “research” protocols scrutinised and approved by the appropriate Ethics Committees. Where is the informed consent? Experimenting on prisoners in Malawi? Where are the records relating to this trial? Why haven’t the Malawi government published anything about how they were apparently part of such a huge success?
A number of explanations are plausible:-
1. Humble conducted the research without any adequate scientific methodology, rendering any trials he did worthless.
2. Humble conducted his trials without appropriate ethical considerations and informed consent. This would put him on a par with the likes of Mengele.
3. The research trials have never actually taken place, in which case he is a fraud and a liar.
I have a couple simple questions for you Paul… Are YOU:
1. infallible?
2. all knowing?
What does it have to do if Paul (or anybody, for that matter) is “infallible” or “all knowing”?
Or are only all-knowin omnipotent beings allowed to question “bishop” Humble’s claims?
Phaelosopher, what you’re being asked is really simple: show us the data that supports Humble’s claims. Where’s the evidence?
It’s a reasonable question. Unless Paul or you are “ALL Knowing,” then you have to admit that there’s stuff that is beyond your present knowledge. That should preclude angry, dismissive, and insultingly suggestive comments about people or ideas that differ from one’s own.
It’s not really important that the question is answered. My asking it has served its purpose for anyone who is reasonable.
I’m not being asked to show you data. NOTHING that I show you will be “acceptable”, since acceptance, except by the narrowest of definitions — that we both know are not going to be presented at this juncture — is not your goal. I use the term “your” collectively to represent the vocal group of “dismissives” that have joined us.
It is unwise to brand people as frauds when the available independent information suggests that their theory is based on sound principles. There is plenty of independent research that could support the proposition that chlorine dioxide use is not only safe, but far more beneficial than many currently popular pharmaceuticals. I realize that this is the real point of opposition… i.e., the prospects (or threat) of replacing drugs. If the public learns more about chlorine dioxide, antibiotics and many other drugs will be understood to be superfluous and detrimental. So I’m not expecting any more than what we’ve already seen.
I’ve been through this before. Two years ago, an author friend publicly dismissed MMS and Jim Humble in his newsletter commentaries, in much the same way that our current band is doing. However, talking with him a couple months ago, he told me about a doctor friend of his who has had some amazing results using MMS, and that he had been using it himself and had great results treating toenail fungus. I presented MMS to a group of American doctors while in Haiti earlier this year. One had a case of eczema on his arm, which we sprayed topically. He also took it internally. The next morning, he volunteered that he felt that the condition had improved. On his own accord, he continued taking it over the course of the next day.
If we agree that there is a common and genuine desire to help people heal, then ALL methods that have a compelling reason for study, will be welcomed and given earnest consideration irrespective of its point of origination, and ALL methods that have a compelling reason to be stopped will also be examined. A reasonable, objective, public demonstration will be devised to compare the new with the old, and BEST RESULTS will determine what comes in, and what goes out.
Best wishes,
Adam…
If the same people always keep asking for proof and reject all our experiences as proof, but at the same time never bring us the proof , “like where is the Sylvia’s coroner report”, than we wasting our ‘time till kingdom come’.
We simply have to agree to disagree.
We will go on telling any experiences we have in future and those people may keep on copy and paste opinions of other people who are like-minted to them-self and ignore our proof. Let it be said that our experiences are more proof to us and anything that anybody who never used writes, will never proof proof anything with posting links, links, links….
so boring
🙂
“I’m not being asked to show you data.”
Yes, actually you are. That is exactly what we are asking. But just in case it wasn’t clear before, let me repeat:
Please show us the data that shows what happens when people take MMS.
Glad we’ve cleared up that little misunderstanding. I look forward to seeing the data now you’ve understood what we’re asking.
Jim is neither a fraud nor a liar. But he is still searching to improve the use of MMS and does not hesitate to be the guinea pig, which is more than can be said of some others who voice their OPINIONS here and elsewhere online…but keep them coming.
A shrink ones told me that people who try to force them self and their opinions onto others have an inferiority complex. They only feel greet if they can belittle and suppress others!
We listening, even if we don’t believe everything everybody says.
@Lory.. the case in a nutshell. The only konstant is Change.! love and light for all living creatures. regards from Denmark
Adam Phaelosopher
It seems to me that all the fuss on this website, all the scorn and hatred being dished out recently by various prolific writers, isn’t about MMS at all! It’s about resistance to the revolution in consciousness that’s accelerating into overdrive right now. Only something this big could generate such fear, hatred and scorn in people who are probably, in the rest of their lives, quite decent human beings.
Imagine the idea that human beings aren’t collections of unrelated symptoms, each requiring its own special drug with millions of dollars of testing and peer-reviewing behind it! Imagine the idea that human beings are actually UNIFIED beings of body, soul and spirit! Imagine that something you take a few drops of when you first get sick, keeps you from having to go to a hospital with all the forms of life-endangerment that go on there! Pretty exciting ideas to a lot of us, but real threatening for some folks!
Hi Lori,
I agree with you. It’s the last gasps of a dying way of thinking. They’re not trying to convince us, or other readers that their way is the best way, or their knowing is all that is valid; they’re trying to convince themselves. We are their worst fears, and their best friends, whether they know it or not. And on that note, they are our best friends too, whether they think of us that way or not. Can you imagine them looking at us that way? 🙂
Once the old divisive mindset is overwritten with a new coherent one, they’ll sound like different people, because they will be different people.
Yes, it is all a last ditch attempt to maintain false ego.
Like a worm wrything on a pin.
The last ditch efforts to maintain power, money and ego control. Their days are numbered. No matter what direction they look change is coming upon them and some people just are afraid to change, to grow, to open their minds, to experience new paradigms, so in that we must maintain compassion for the work at hand. For some it is a scary new world that challenges the foundation of all they think they are.
I’m sorry for them… but not too sorry ; ))
for like all of us who have freedom of mind and spirit we have worked though limited awareness and opened our own doors of perception and they must go through the struggle also till they find their own key.
Phaelosopher, Arrow Durfee, Lori and others – wake up and smell the coffee. Understand the true meaning of skepticism. Open your minds.
If you and others wish to continue to consume MMS, that’s your choice and you’re perfectly at liberty to make that choice. As Voltaire once said – “I do not agree with what you have to say, but I’ll defend to the death your right to say it.”
Neither my ego or that of any of the scientists here is false or oversized – if you have scientific proof that shows that MMS is safe and effective as a therapy, please post it here. Nothing posted so far by the MMS advocates comes even close to being real, credible, verifiable scientific evidence. If such evidence is ever posted, it will be scrutinised according to the standards of science. If it then shows MMS to be a safe and effective therapy, it will be accepted as such.
Personally, I’m not holding my breath on this one.
Paul,
If you were willing to think independently, you can figure it out yourself. The real delusion is in maintaining the belief that truth is unknowable except by a select few and under the “accepted” conditions. The sad thing is that, with all your “smarts,” you don’t even include yourself among those who can figure it out.